Put yourself in Ice T's shoes for a minute. You're a pioneering and controversial emcee who commanded a coast and changed the game in more ways than one. You came up alongside cats like Big Daddy Kane, Ice Cube, Rakim and the other greats. In the world of hip hop, you've got war stories to tell and it goes without saying that you've earned a fair share of respect in the game. Since the early 80's, you've spoken your mind and held back nothing. You said something that a lot of people in the hip hop community have already been feeling for about a year now, and along comes Soulja Boy to refute your claims. A kid who isn't even old enough to vote is treating you not even as an equal, but as an inferior being. Now come back... Watch that video above (though I'm sure you already have).
How can anyone stomach to watch that sh*t? Even worse, where does Soulja Boy get the gall to be so disrespectful and downright arrogant? This is a kid who considers 50 Cent to be "old school"! I'm expressing my opinion not only as a response to Soulja Boy's video, but to a recent post by none other than Kanye West. Here's what 'Ye had to say:
The true meaning of hip hop, as I see it, is much more than being "fresh ass hell". Sure, that's got a lot to do with it. But it's also about creating something that is worthy of respect, worthy of a legacy -- and not just on a monetary level! The fact that Soulja Boy's "music" is considered noteworthy by the media says a lot about the state of things and what the "popular public" is willing to accept. Twenty years ago, this lame buffoonery would never slide. I'm referring of course to the golden era of hip hop; yes, the real golden era of hip hop. There's a reason why there's a golden era of television (50's - early 60's), of radio (20's - early 60's) and of film. That was the definitive golden age of each respective field of media. That time has gone and all we can do is aim to make the best of it at the present. To the up-and-coming actor, he or she should know that this isn't the golden era of film or television! An aspiring radio host knows well enough that the radio golden years are long gone. And so I think it's important to note the fallacies of defending Soulja Boy as the savior of his "own" golden era. It's just not the case...
But truth be told, that's all aside the point: to say that Soulja Boy's music has a "hidden meaning" (regardless of whatever era you'd like to juxtapose it with) is a disgrace to the poets and emcees who truly put hidden meanings and depth into their writing(s).
One final statement to (w)rap things up and I'm out: To crucify cats like Soulja Boy as the "murderers of hip hop" may be harsh and perhaps excessive. Let's be fair now: a lot of these kids didn't (and don't) have the background they should in order to contribute to hip hop's legacy (in a positive way). So you wanna say Soulja Boy isn't 100% responsible for "killing hip hop? Fine. But you know what does kill hip hop? Putting Soulja Boy on the pedestal as if he's the embodiment of it; as if he's truly got talent comparable to the legends of the past and present. It says a lot about what you think hip hop is and has the potential to be. It says a lot about you. You wanna play a little 'Superman' or 'A Bay Bay' in the club? Be my guest. But that's about it... Please! For the sake of hip hop!!!
Soulja boy is fresh ass hell and is actually the true meaning of what hip hop is sposed to be. He came from the hood, made his own beats, made up a new saying, new sound and a new dance with one song. He had all of America rapping this summer. If that ain't Hip Hop then what is? A bunch of wannabe keep it real rappers that ain't even relevant, recycling samples trying to act like it's 96 again and all they do is hate on new shit? Niggas always talk about the golden age but for a 13 year old kid, this is the golden age!!! That song was so dope cause everything he said had a hidden meaning... that's Nas level shit... he just put it over some steel drums which is also some Nas shit if you had the 2nd album cassette with the bonus track "Silent Murder" on it. In closing... new niggas get ya money$$$$$$$$$$ Keep this shit fresh and original.... ain't no fuckin' rules to this shit and that's what real hip hop is to me. [LINK]Now I've got respect for Kanye, but some of this sh*t is just ridiculous! Soulja Boy is the "true meaning of hip hop"? Really 'Ye? "This is the golden age"!? Really 'Ye? Comparing Soulja Boy to Nas!?!? Really 'Ye?
The true meaning of hip hop, as I see it, is much more than being "fresh ass hell". Sure, that's got a lot to do with it. But it's also about creating something that is worthy of respect, worthy of a legacy -- and not just on a monetary level! The fact that Soulja Boy's "music" is considered noteworthy by the media says a lot about the state of things and what the "popular public" is willing to accept. Twenty years ago, this lame buffoonery would never slide. I'm referring of course to the golden era of hip hop; yes, the real golden era of hip hop. There's a reason why there's a golden era of television (50's - early 60's), of radio (20's - early 60's) and of film. That was the definitive golden age of each respective field of media. That time has gone and all we can do is aim to make the best of it at the present. To the up-and-coming actor, he or she should know that this isn't the golden era of film or television! An aspiring radio host knows well enough that the radio golden years are long gone. And so I think it's important to note the fallacies of defending Soulja Boy as the savior of his "own" golden era. It's just not the case...
But truth be told, that's all aside the point: to say that Soulja Boy's music has a "hidden meaning" (regardless of whatever era you'd like to juxtapose it with) is a disgrace to the poets and emcees who truly put hidden meanings and depth into their writing(s).
One final statement to (w)rap things up and I'm out: To crucify cats like Soulja Boy as the "murderers of hip hop" may be harsh and perhaps excessive. Let's be fair now: a lot of these kids didn't (and don't) have the background they should in order to contribute to hip hop's legacy (in a positive way). So you wanna say Soulja Boy isn't 100% responsible for "killing hip hop? Fine. But you know what does kill hip hop? Putting Soulja Boy on the pedestal as if he's the embodiment of it; as if he's truly got talent comparable to the legends of the past and present. It says a lot about what you think hip hop is and has the potential to be. It says a lot about you. You wanna play a little 'Superman' or 'A Bay Bay' in the club? Be my guest. But that's about it... Please! For the sake of hip hop!!!
P.S./UPDATE:
Ice T responds to the above video:
Is anyone else thinking there might be a Soulja Boy dis mixtape in the midst?
ReplyDeletemaybe, but even if he makes a tape just to dis Ice, he ain't going to win..
ReplyDeletemy respect has gone down for kanye for his comment and as for soulja boy everything ice-t said was correct i hate the guy
ReplyDeleteice-t knows whats hes saying, but soulja boy doesnt have a clue
ReplyDeleteI dunno about a dis tape... It might be kinda pointless....
ReplyDeleteAll I know is Ice T is kickin' facts -- straight up! He's not speaking for himself. He's not even speaking for the West coast. He's speaking for hip hop.
preach!
ReplyDeleteyour such a fucking dork ivan.
ReplyDeletehope off the nuts anon.
ReplyDeleteSoulja just a 'Ringtone Rapper'. Kanye does speak some shit sometimes. And 'recycled samples'?? Does Stronger ring a bell Ye?
ReplyDeleteBeef got old a long time ago. So Soulja should keep his mouth shut until he actually achieves something in Hip-Hop. Jay-Z said nobody is even worth responding to unless u got at least one classic album.
Ice T a true G.
And if this is a golden era for hip-hop then im done with it...
man yall need to leave soulja boy alone. all the boy wants to do is make music. his right, ice t is old and if he (ice t) really feels like soulja boy is "killing hip hop" den he should try and help him and save it.
ReplyDeleteam sorry but ice t aint even dat grt. dnt no body know who half the ppl from his era is anyways. i mean everyone knows snoop and dre but i bet you ppl gonna struggle to remember who the fuck ice t is. soulja boy represents the new era and if ppl dnt like it den they should get the fuck on. ice t should be ashamed of himself anyways. how u gonna start beef with a sumone dats ova half ur age. i say he lost respect rite there by doin dat. in my opinion every1 needs to chill with this whole hip hop is dead shit. at least soulja boy isnt talkin bout guns knifes and fucking killin sumone.
^ Spoken like a true Stan.
ReplyDelete"at least soulja boy isnt talkin bout guns knifes and fucking killin sumone."
I'd rather hear violent lyrics from a Kool G Rap or a Nas or Mobb Deep as opposed to the complete sub-par-reading-level-ignorance of Soulja Boy's "writing".
Soulja Boy started this sh*t by making wack "music". He's open for critique now, and Ice T ain't even the first to call him (Soulja Boy) out...
Ivan -
ReplyDeleteI think you summed it up best with the paragraph about the Golden Age of hip hop, television, etc.
"Artists" like SB have their place in today's music industry and pop culture. Which is fine - nobody should be persecuted for their musical tastes, no matter how un-original or mass-produced some people deem it to be.
'Ye's comments are those of a man raised to believe that he is a prince among the little people. I blame his upbringing for all the empty, ego-maniacal shit that comes out of his mouth.
SB comes from the same rotted pea-pod of pampered industry princes; raised to believe that they are musical geniuses.
But I don't think anyone should get their knickers in too much of twist about these statements regarding "old" musicians like Ice T. Anyone who really appreciates music will know the difference between people like SB and folks like KRS or Ice T.
It happens with every passing generation. The younger people are chalked full of energy but don't have the experience to know their eyes from their asses. So they talk shit on the old folks - cos it's it's cliche. It's easy. It's perfect - SB is only perpetuating an age old behavior. Which, in and of itself, just goes to show how un-original and small minded he really is. He's not challenging the system, breaking boundaries or making new and interesting realities. He's just being a fuckin KID.
So until the Magical Innovation Fairy lays a golden turd under SB's pillow, the grown people will be busy listening to shit that matters/ed.
- Tara
ps: Kanye West IS and always HAS been overrated. Over him.
ok. first of all tar: kanye west is not overated. hes brillant at wat he does.
ReplyDeleteand second of all ivan: hip hop influencies alot of people's lifes.. if every1 had ur view and would rather listen to violent music den God only knows wre we would be 2dai.
and every1 has their own take on wat hip op is. if u dnt like soulja boy's music den dnt listen 2 it. its as simple as dat. i dnt like nas or ice t so u wnt catch me listening 2 dem.
The way in which you (mis)spell your opinions proves its own point... But I digress.
ReplyDeleteihart -
ReplyDeleteI gave up reading half way into the comment. It's hard to take you seriously, let alone read through your post because you can't spell a comprehensive sentence.
ps: ihart, my name is Tara.
pps: Ivan, I don't know you have the patience to sift throurh comment posts.
For your information, i can speel a comprehensive sentence. I am very well educated but find it easier to write short hand while on a computer. I know your name is Tara, it was a miss-type.
ReplyDeleteThe point I was trying to make was, if you don't like Soulja Boy then don't listen to his music (and that goes for Ice T and his "era.")
Good points Tara.
ReplyDeleteThing about SB is the lack of any originality or thought in his 'music'. He got a novelty dance and thats it..
Ice T was part of a big Gangsta rap movement. He made Cop Killer ffs.
SB makes music with a calculator, coming up with a formula to simply make money. What about the art of Hip-Hop?
Ice T done some shit that added to the culture so SB should fal back.
PS Ivan: Where the Cbox man?? You know thats my shit.
Sometimes hip-hop really inspires me. Other times, I pull out HipHop is Dead by Nas (followed by Hip Hop by KRS-One and Hip Hop by Joel Ortiz) and just really bask in my disappointment for a minute.
ReplyDeleteIce T - Don't make anymore videos. After seeing the second one, you are completely in the right. After apologizing for the "eat a dick" comment, you've said nothing wrong.
Soulja Boy - Seriously man, please just think about your lyrics! You're terrible. Go advocate a cause, care about something, get people to vote, give some money away. Your brand of HipHop is NOT SOCIALLY RELEVANT!
Kanye - It's so hard to maintain respect for you, man.
Anonymous - Eat a dick!
ihart- Read a book. (Try this one: http://www.cantstopwontstop.com/book.cfm)
Ivan - You ALWAYS keep it real.
"Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe people like your kind of hip hop. Maybe nobody cares about lyrics no more. Maybe no one cares about kids who go to the studio and bleed over a track. Maybe hip hop is just about some bull shii ass dance. Maybe that's what it is But I'm gonna let hip hop speak on that." (Ice T)
ReplyDeleteThat's it right there. I don't think most people care anymore. So I choose to listen to those who do, and try not to hate too much on those who don't. But damn, Soulja Boy made himself sound real dumb with some of those comments.
Tara: "Ivan, I don't know you have the patience to sift throurh comment posts."
ReplyDeleteMe neither, yo... Me neither...
ihart: "For your information, i can speel a comprehensive sentence."
Hot damn, ho, here we go again...
FD: "Where the Cbox man?? You know thats my shit."
Real soon man. I suspended it for a while due to some spammers.
Nay: "You ALWAYS keep it real."
'ppreciate it fam!
Jason: You got it, man!
ihart: "For your information, i can speel a comprehensive sentence."
ReplyDeleteYou have just made my day.
I respect your opinion, Ivan, but thats what it is, an opinion..
ReplyDeleteTo start off I want to say I'm not a fan of soulja boy or any "hip-pop" music.. now it's obvious you have knowledge on hiphop but I disagree w you on this one..
soulja boy is a young kid that made a song that some people liked, got some hype, and got paid to make some music.. how can you hate on that? regardless of what kind of music it is (garbage imo) who are you to say it's "killing hiphop"? people make way to big a deal about this shit, it's music, if some people like it who gives a fuck?
soulja boy ain't saying he's the greatest rapper ever or some shit, he's built himself a career by himself which is pretty difficult nowadays, if anything you should be mad at the people who pay him to make the music..
and who the fuck is ice t to come at a 17 yr old kid for no reason? he deserved to be clowned, if he doesn't like the music thats fine but dudes 17 give him a break.. I could see if soulja boy was talking shit saying he's better than some legends or something but he hasn't..
bottom line- it's just fuckin music, people can hate all they want but I guarantee yall would do the same thing if someone was telling you that your shit is hot and that they wanna give you millions of dollars to do what you love doing
Hip-Hop. Rap. Where's the difference anymore? Remember when you could explicitly tell? Hip-hop's been dying since the man threw blood to the sharks. Now we're all divided trying to figure out where to go next...hip-hop will never die...but come the hell on with this Soulja Boy shit. Dancing is nothing new in hip-hop YES, but there was actually work involved in the old music. Check all the old dance tracks from the true golden era, the music was almost orchestrated; everything was on point. You danced to a great beat with party time lyrics, and every once in a while someone slipped a message in there. Nowadays it's sing songing full out trash - that sounds like a 5 year old banged it out on a Casio keyboard. That's what gets me tight when people say 'oh let them have their fun', 'they're kids' and etc., dig this - how old were the people putting out the music in the late 80's/90's? That's why 'hip-hop is on life support', the listeners got lazy with the artists.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous said...
ReplyDelete...and who the fuck is ice t to come at a 17 yr old kid for no reason? he deserved to be clowned, if he doesn't like the music thats fine but dudes 17 give him a break.. I could see if soulja boy was talking shit saying he's better than some legends or something but he hasn't..
bottom line- it's just fuckin music, people can hate all they want but I guarantee yall would do the same thing if someone was telling you that your shit is hot and that they wanna give you millions of dollars to do what you love doing...
^^^^ yeah, it's obvious that you didn't watch the video and don't have a clue as to what the hell you're talking about, especially since you're "not a fan of any hip hop music" (your words, homie). and yet you're here. on a hip hop blog. but i digress...
well, let's keep it general. it's basically about substance>monetary gain FIRST. ice t comes from an age where quality mattered and was speaking with that frame of mind. period. it's not hard to get that. mind you, this type of music was also made around that time when he was at the height of his rap career, but you were not respected AND PEOPLE HAD NO PROBLEM TELLING YOU THAT YOU WERE GARBAGE. now, if you were in denial (or did had some skills but just put out some garbage just to sell records), and had a problem with them saying you were garbage, all you had to do was either respond to them on record and let your skills back you up, or you approach them at their show, you battle, and let word of mouth handle the rest...
by the way, the irony is that ice t was looked at by his rap peers the same way he's looking at/talking about soulja boy. and he basically gave the same explanation that soulja boy is saying now (but explained it from a pimp/ho point of view). that fool was NO rapper (he said it himself). and not like dudes say it now [i'm not a rapper, i'm a (fill in blank)]. he seriously hopped in for the money. and like you said about soulja boy, he wasn't making claims to being the best rapper. the only difference is he RESPECTED HIP HOP. there's no rules now like there were then. and with kanye saying "there's no rules in hip hop"? that's some bullshit. i mean, i get what 'ye was saying, but what he was talking about has nothing to do with what ice t was speaking on. but IMO, 'ye was speaking on the rap game side of things, while ice t was speaking from a hip hop stand point: respect, culture, skills, etc...
bottom line - ice t's point is at the end of the day, soulja boy will have his ass handed to him if was involved in a rhyme cypher with a bunch of kindergarten kids.
or fior those who are ACTUALLY fans of hip hop who disagree:
if soulja boy was in a rap battle with ANYBODY, who would you bet on?
anon: "how can you hate on that?"
ReplyDeleteCuz it's wick-wick-WACK! That's how I can hate on it.
It's unfair to use a reverse ageism defense to support Soulja Boy's position. Just because he's young doesn't mean he has immunity from being called out for putting out garbage.
To clarify (first post) I meant a mixtape dissing soulja boy, not one made by him
ReplyDeleteBut it's kinda hard to envision when most of the artists wouldn't even bother to mutter his (souja) name.(and rightly so)
Alternatively top artists should co-lab for a tape. Imagine everyone together spitting real hip-hop showing as a true art form.
Fuck sales make something for the streets/internet prove that you still love it (look a wale "mixtape about nothing" it's fucking brilliant), give back to what gave you so much
P.S.
Listening to soulja boy is like been fisted in the ear by an elephant
P.S.S
I would/should use something other than anon, tis force of habit.
the whole story is wack...
ReplyDeleteice-t is a legend, sb a kid....
the video from sb says all, fu**in young studio-g...
Ivan said...
ReplyDeleteanon: "how can you hate on that?"
Cuz it's wick-wick-WACK! That's how I can hate on it.
It's unfair to use a reverse ageism defense to support Soulja Boy's position. Just because he's young doesn't mean he has immunity from being called out for putting out garbage
I was the anon who posted the post your responding to, and that other guy..
to kurtgangbang, I forget the name, I said I'm not a fan of "hip-POP", that what I classify soulja boy as, hipPOP or just pop, but nice try trying to say I don't like any hiphop smart one..
to Ivan, I don't see your point, yeah it's wack but it's music, some people may not see it as wack, but just because you think it's wack soulja boy is "dissrespecting hiphop"? haha he made a song and just because a lot of people liked it people like you wanna come out and attack him.. If someone came to you and said I'll give you 5million to sing this song, you wouldn't do it? haha
and soulja boy wasn't the first artist to start this kind of music, it was around 2 or 3 yrs. before he even popped off but HE takes all the blame for it cause hes the only one that is making money and selling records and I think it's wack to hate on somebody for making a song, gimme a break are we still in grade school?
if he came out trying to clown t or the legends like g rap or rakim first then I would be with yall but he's not saying anything about anybody.. I mean you can not like him and say his music is garbage cause it is but it's stupid to attack him personally cause he's just doing anything a kid his age would.. imo why waste time hatin on sb when you could be showing people good hiphop, if people stopping talking about him and making a big ho ass deal about him then he will just go away..
man, fuck kanye. funk doc was on point w/ the comment about "stronger." "original sound"? "recycled samples"? he was trying to chomp dilla's whole shit on "finding forever." like he didn't know j. rawls flipped that gil scott-heron track for black star's "brown skin lady."
ReplyDeletei know jocking their own shit is part of the persona of these so-called "rap stars," but this is bordering on delusional...
^ you said it purp'!
ReplyDeleteWhen a fool like soulja boy (?) gets industry backing, attention and money, a better quality artist gets whatever's leftover. This shapes the direction that artists go into the studio with. And what's played on the radio influences the up and coming artists. So, hip hop < what it could be.
ReplyDeleteKayne,
I know that you didn't just try to make the argument that soulja boy is some kind of new 2Live Crew. What a loathsome cunt you are. Go, just say what you have to about the big labels' artists and keep sucking on whatever you have to to keep your career ! Keep your eyes on your meal ticket ! I have nothing but contempt for you. Now.
- - -
soulja boy,
I respect you. You got jokes ! But still. Ask any of your friends if they would rather hear your jokes, or pay to watch Ice T give you a pimp beating. He's gonna get 'chu !
^ lol
ReplyDeleteHAHAHAH -
ReplyDeleteNo!!! STOP IT!! & Purple_Crayons: You two just made my day. I wanted to go off on Kanye more in my previous posts, but you guys took the words right out of my mouth.
Soulja Boy is an idiot. If it weren't for Ice-T there would be no Soulja Boy. Kids today have no respect for history or their elders.
ReplyDeleteMark: That's true, and that's probably my biggest problem w/SB. (At least his response video).
ReplyDeleteNo! Stop!!! and Purple Crayons: Thats exactly what im feelin'.
ReplyDeleteRecycled samples eh...
Who exactly got paid offa Stronger? Kanye? Daft Punk? Edwyn Birdsong?
Reminds me of Murda Inc in the dark days of 2002...
The saddest thing about the whole argument is what it shows about the state of "Hip-Hop" fandom - the art form is seen as nothing more than a commodity anymore, something you just make and sell, it doesn't have to "mean" anything anymore. I think that's the real conflict here - many of us who come from a time before hip-hop were drawn to it because it did mean something, it spoke to us and told our stories. For the kids who are growing up now, having always known hip-hop, being surround by it in commercials and in store soundtracks, Hip-hop is nothing more than background music. It's like if you were a child of the 80's and all you heard was heavy metal and new wave everywhere you went THAT was your background music - and then when Hip-Hop came along it was like "oh shit" this is speaking to me!" These kids now, hip-hop has always been their background music, it all sounds the same to them so they don't differentiate between good and bad music. Maybe they're just waitin to grow up, to need a music that speaks to them the way Hip-Hop spoke to us. It's actually kind of sad for them because it shows that they're missing something meaningful in their lives that they care about and want to see reflected in their music. I see this all the time with my middle school students - most of the time they don't even know what they are missing in life because the have never seen anything better. If you aren't brought up to expect greatness you will never be able to recognize it when comes.
ReplyDeleteI hope the argument doesn't devolve into "eat a dick vs. old ass n***" because all that shows is the ignorance of both sides. Settle it the way hip-hop beefs used to be settled - make a record where you absolutely kill the track and let the fans decide who really has skills.
-signed: A Child of the Golden Age